NADAC Forum

General => General Discussion => Topic started by: tonyterry on July 18, 2016, 09:53:20 PM

Title: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 18, 2016, 09:53:20 PM
My 7 year old Australian Shepherd just had bladder stone surgery and they came back as SILICA STONES which is more rare than rare.
I am having a terrible time finding a dog food that is grain free, wheat free, soy free corn free. It has to be a low SILICA diet. ANYONE OUT THERE THAT CAN HELP ME
Poor Rider is on chicken and rice and i know that can not be  forever, he is missing all of the vitamins and minerals
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Lynne Almeida on July 18, 2016, 11:13:08 PM
Hi Terry, Willow here!  ;)

I feed our gals The Honest Kitchen, it has several formulas and many are grain-free.  I think for silica you want to eliminate rice, corn and soy and go easy on the vegetables.  Maybe Orijen or Acana for a kibble?  I'm feeding Acana to our Golden Retriver foster; I think it's a great quality kibble high in meat content.

Hope Rider feels better and we'll see you guys soon!
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: bhodges865 on July 19, 2016, 07:42:15 AM
I have been feeding Zignature for the last few years and LOVE it!!  Looking on their website, it should meet your needs.  And a lot of stores that carry it have samples you can try.  Here is what they say about their product:

Physiologically Tuned™, limited ingredient premium food for dogs. Hypo-allergenic meat first recipe, with no Corn, Wheat, Soy, Dairy or Chicken, Chicken Eggs or Chicken By-Products

You can order online if there isn't a store close to you.  I know Gail, who shows Aussies in NADAC, at Tin Woof Inn sells it and has samples in their store.
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Audri, Cee Cee, Lily, Toto, and Calypso on July 19, 2016, 09:27:37 AM
I found this interesting and did a quick google search on what they were.  An article on Dogaware.com said that even drinking from water sources that may contain sand or hard water can develop these stones and should drink distilled water instead....  WOW!  There is a whole list of ingredients to avoid plus increase fluid intake.  The good news is, they don't reoccur if the diet is changed! 

This is one of the articles I looked at, but there were a whole slew of others.

http://dogaware.com/articles/wdjotherstones.html
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Vicki Storrs on July 19, 2016, 11:02:22 AM
I work at a dog food store and the Orijin/Acana lines are one of the brands I have heartily endorsed, as I have found the company to be extremely reputable.  However just be aware that they have begun this year manufacturing in the US (as opposed to their home base in Canada) the products that they sell in the US.  While I don't believe they have changed their company standards and goals, they HAVE changed their formulations--necessary since they try to do as much local sourcing as possible. So for instance they are now using things like catfish that weren't in the Canadian manufactured foods.  And we are getting a number of customers who feed this line having their dogs having some issues with the new formulations...
Meanwhile in the last couple years I have had two dogs have bladder stones, a possible third one that will be checked out next week (and in around 40 years of dogs these have been my first problems with stones) and two nights ago I was in the ER with what turned out to be stones!  So I am looking for some possible environmental link that may have been causing this rash of issues!
Vicki
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Edraith on July 19, 2016, 11:11:58 AM
Hmm i have been using Orijin and Acana and did not know that, I will pay attention...just went to vet today for GI issues. But in reality, she seems to get into something every 6-8 months. We do SAR as well as lots of hiking so who knows what all she gets into running in the woods sometimes drinking out of mud puddles or finding deer carcasses to roll in...lucky we don't have more issues than we do  ::)
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 20, 2016, 08:35:49 PM
i have looked at all of these foods and they all have great protein but then lots of veggies that he is not suppose to have.  I am really struggling here, he can not live on white rice and chicken much longer, he is really hungry for some food with substance and i am sure that he is becoming malnourished
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: MoabDiane on July 20, 2016, 09:00:10 PM
My suggestion is that you contact Susan Wynn, DVM, in Georgia.  She can formulate a homemade diet specifically for your dog's health situation, or tell you the best commercial food to feed.
Unless you are IN the state of Georgia, you'll have to go through your local vet - since she hasn't seen your dog. 
Go to her website and you'll find the questionnaire to complete; the vet must complete a simple one page part of it.
susanwynn.com

diane
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Amanda Nelson on July 20, 2016, 09:07:25 PM
i have looked at all of these foods and they all have great protein but then lots of veggies that he is not suppose to have.  I am really struggling here, he can not live on white rice and chicken much longer, he is really hungry for some food with substance and i am sure that he is becoming malnourished
You may have to look into making food for him, I would highly recommend Monica Segal. She does canine nutrition consults and does an excellent job.
Amanda

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Vicki Storrs on July 21, 2016, 04:42:28 AM
I know the vet school at UC Davis does nutritional consults (can be done remote, if you're not in that area) working with you and your vet. Can formulate home recipes as well as suggesting commercial options if suitable.
Vicki
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 21, 2016, 06:43:09 AM
I am working thru my vet in Reno to a vet in San Francisco(remote) Dr Lily Johnson a Nutritionist but it is taking sssoooooooooo long and feeding him chicken and rice now for 10 days is making me worry about his vitamins and minerals. 
Has anyone out there fed EVO ????????????
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 21, 2016, 08:31:46 AM
i am looking into ACANA and sent this to my vet to see if she approves it
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Vicki Storrs on July 21, 2016, 05:39:38 PM
EVO was part of my rotation briefly in the early 2000's. I stopped feeding it when Procter and Gamble purchased the company in 2010. They had multiple recalls in 2013, then were sold to Mars in 2014.  Just my own preference, I try to stick with foods that are independently owned rather than being just a small part of some large corporation.
Champion makes Acana and Orijen. Besides being a Canadian company (gotta love the Canadians, right??!!) they identify their suppliers...by name...which for me inspires confidence. One of our sales reps toured their plant and his lunch was made with raw ingredients from the dog food.  I thought that was impressive. That being said, I have already mentioned their formula changes because of their new US plants (with the bags getting smaller) that have me a little concerned. I am reserving judgement until I see how it all shakes out.  The roll out has been gradual, seems like it was Acana first, protein source by protein source.  We just today got the first "American" bag of Orijen fish.

Vicki
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Sharon Nelson on July 21, 2016, 06:11:22 PM
EVO was part of my rotation briefly in the early 2000's. I stopped feeding it when Procter and Gamble purchased the company in 2010. They had multiple recalls in 2013, then were sold to Mars in 2014.  Just my own preference, I try to stick with foods that are independently owned rather than being just a small part of some large corporation.
Champion makes Acana and Orijen. Besides being a Canadian company (gotta love the Canadians, right??!!) they identify their suppliers...by name...which for me inspires confidence. One of our sales reps toured their plant and his lunch was made with raw ingredients from the dog food.  I thought that was impressive. That being said, I have already mentioned their formula changes because of their new US plants (with the bags getting smaller) that have me a little concerned. I am reserving judgement until I see how it all shakes out.  The roll out has been gradual, seems like it was Acana first, protein source by protein source.  We just today got the first "American" bag of Orijen fish.

Vicki
I agree with your evaluation of EVO.  Used to be a great product but has changed hands several times.  No confidence there........

Orijen and Acana are off my list now that they are moving the product to the US.  "I" believe that some of the Canadian sources are much better than US sources... so I will stop using Acana now that is it rolling in with American sources.  I hope I am very wrong and Acana will remain a GREAT product, but I lost some confidence when they switched locations and sources.....

Feeding dogs is WAY too tough anymore!  Too much money is spent promoting the label names on most instead of producing the best possible quality!  But they do have to sell food to make a profit and so much of that is about their advertising dollar and the return on that dollar.

Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Vicki Storrs on July 21, 2016, 06:30:14 PM
Yeah, I agree, I just instinctively trust the Canadian and New Zealand/Australian brands more! Not ones that "seem" to be from down under because of their name, but actually are manufactured there.  And the sourcing of the of the ingredients has a lot to do with it. 
I BELIEVE Champion still has their Canadian plants, they're just manufacturing for Canada in them. A case where their success meant they needed more manufacturing capability and thought moving the plants closer to the market would be cost effective. But I'm worried that rational is going to come back to bite  them.  Maybe our Canadian NADAC people can smuggle it over the border for us!! (Just Kidding!)
Vicki
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Shirley Wallace on July 21, 2016, 07:11:19 PM
There is one more brand of grain free food worth looking into.  Annamaet Petfoods, based in Pennsylvania, has 3 grain free formulas.  The company is family owned and run and has been since its inception in 1986.   The owner, Rob Downey, is a personal friend (which of course makes me a little biased) and I don't know anyone who has a higher level of integrity and dedication than Rob.  We have been feeding Annamaet since 1987, and have the Midwest distributorship for it.  It can be ordered online as well.  The 3 formulas are Aqualuk (cold water based), Salcha (poultry based), and Manitok (red meat based).  I just went to their website to check the exact ingredient list, and there is no "hidden" grains that I can see.  There are some vegetables.  I saw peas  and chick peas. 
I am by no means an expert on this, but I know that Annamaet is a quality product.  Couldn't hurt to look at it.
Incidentally, Rob has just been named as a 2016 Pet Age Icon.
Shirley Wallace
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Sharon Nelson on July 21, 2016, 10:27:54 PM
There is one more brand of grain free food worth looking into.  Annamaet Petfoods, based in Pennsylvania, has 3 grain free formulas.  The company is family owned and run and has been since its inception in 1986.   The owner, Rob Downey, is a personal friend (which of course makes me a little biased) and I don't know anyone who has a higher level of integrity and dedication than Rob.  We have been feeding Annamaet since 1987, and have the Midwest distributorship for it.  It can be ordered online as well.  The 3 formulas are Aqualuk (cold water based), Salcha (poultry based), and Manitok (red meat based).  I just went to their website to check the exact ingredient list, and there is no "hidden" grains that I can see.  There are some vegetables.  I saw peas  and chick peas. 
I am by no means an expert on this, but I know that Annamaet is a quality product.  Couldn't hurt to look at it.
Incidentally, Rob has just been named as a 2016 Pet Age Icon.
Shirley Wallace

I would certainly vouch for how Shirley's dog's look on it!!  I have used their treats (which are made from the same formula as their food) and my dog's LOVE it!!

Sharon
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Vicki Storrs on July 22, 2016, 05:29:02 AM
My store--an independent t dealership--doesn't carry Annamaet simply because it has an exclusive contract with another shop locally. We'd love to have it available otherwise. There are a LOT of grain free nibbles  out there, many of them quite good, and then there is also raw, and there are brands without veggies or grains there--but of course the whole silica issue does complicate it more than just simply grain free.  Will probably take some research, trusted medical advice, and not too much input from the likes of us who have never faced this specific issue :-).  Best of luck finding a solution that works for you!
Vicki
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:03:45 AM
EVO was part of my rotation briefly in the early 2000's. I stopped feeding it when Procter and Gamble purchased the company in 2010. They had multiple recalls in 2013, then were sold to Mars in 2014.  Just my own preference, I try to stick with foods that are independently owned rather than being just a small part of some large corporation.
Champion makes Acana and Orijen. Besides being a Canadian company (gotta love the Canadians, right??!!) they identify their suppliers...by name...which for me inspires confidence. One of our sales reps toured their plant and his lunch was made with raw ingredients from the dog food.  I thought that was impressive. That being said, I have already mentioned their formula changes because of their new US plants (with the bags getting smaller) that have me a little concerned. I am reserving judgement until I see how it all shakes out.  The roll out has been gradual, seems like it was Acana first, protein source by protein source.  We just today got the first "American" bag of Orijen fish.

Vicki
I agree with your evaluation of EVO.  Used to be a great product but has changed hands several times.  No confidence there........

Orijen and Acana are off my list now that they are moving the product to the US.  "I" believe that some of the Canadian sources are much better than US sources... so I will stop using Acana now that is it rolling in with American sources.  I hope I am very wrong and Acana will remain a GREAT product, but I lost some confidence when they switched locations and sources.....

Feeding dogs is WAY too tough anymore!  Too much money is spent promoting the label names on most instead of producing the best possible quality!  But they do have to sell food to make a profit and so much of that is about their advertising dollar and the return on that dollar.
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:04:50 AM
Sharon,

What dog food do you feed??
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:08:25 AM
ok i am so sorry but i am trying to figure out how to reply to the posts from everyone and can not figure out how to do it other than  doing a NEW POST HELPPPPPPPPPP
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:13:10 AM
i have looked at all of these foods and they all have great protein but then lots of veggies that he is not suppose to have.  I am really struggling here, he can not live on white rice and chicken much longer, he is really hungry for some food with substance and i am sure that he is becoming malnourished
You may have to look into making food for him, I would highly recommend Monica Segal. She does canine nutrition consults and does an excellent job.
Amanda

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

Who is Monica Segal and how do i contact her????????????????????
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:17:41 AM
when i called Champion Pet Food yesterday she told me that she had no idea what the SILICA content of their food is. My friend who works in Nature Made Vitamins said that all products have to know what their ingredients are but if they are low enough do not need to be printed on the label. But Champion said they had no idea??????????????
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:28:40 AM
i have looked at all of these foods and they all have great protein but then lots of veggies that he is not suppose to have.  I am really struggling here, he can not live on white rice and chicken much longer, he is really hungry for some food with substance and i am sure that he is becoming malnourished
You may have to look into making food for him, I would highly recommend Monica Segal. She does canine nutrition consults and does an excellent job.
Amanda


I just looked up Monica and just set up for a telephone consultation, i will let you know how it goes-thank you

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:32:18 AM
There is one more brand of grain free food worth looking into.  Annamaet Petfoods, based in Pennsylvania, has 3 grain free formulas.  The company is family owned and run and has been since its inception in 1986.   The owner, Rob Downey, is a personal friend (which of course makes me a little biased) and I don't know anyone who has a higher level of integrity and dedication than Rob.  We have been feeding Annamaet since 1987, and have the Midwest distributorship for it.  It can be ordered online as well.  The 3 formulas are Aqualuk (cold water based), Salcha (poultry based), and Manitok (red meat based).  I just went to their website to check the exact ingredient list, and there is no "hidden" grains that I can see.  There are some vegetables.  I saw peas  and chick peas. 
I am by no means an expert on this, but I know that Annamaet is a quality product.  Couldn't hurt to look at it.
Incidentally, Rob has just been named as a 2016 Pet Age Icon.
Shirley Wallace

i am going to call them right now- thank youooooooouuuuuu
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:38:48 AM
i have looked at all of these foods and they all have great protein but then lots of veggies that he is not suppose to have.  I am really struggling here, he can not live on white rice and chicken much longer, he is really hungry for some food with substance and i am sure that he is becoming malnourished
You may have to look into making food for him, I would highly recommend Monica Segal. She does canine nutrition consults and does an excellent job.
Amanda

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

Who is Monica Segal and how do i contact her????????????????????




just sent in for a consultation -=thankyou
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: LeeAnne McAdam on July 22, 2016, 07:58:58 AM
i have looked at all of these foods and they all have great protein but then lots of veggies that he is not suppose to have.  I am really struggling here, he can not live on white rice and chicken much longer, he is really hungry for some food with substance and i am sure that he is becoming malnourished
You may have to look into making food for him, I would highly recommend Monica Segal. She does canine nutrition consults and does an excellent job.
Amanda

Her website is monicasegal.com.  I believe she's in Canada but I could be mistaken.  She has a lot of information on her website, but she also specializes in individualized diets.  Good luck!

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

Who is Monica Segal and how do i contact her????????????????????
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: dogrsqr on July 22, 2016, 10:06:01 AM
I was wondering myself how you would know about silica content in dog food.   

From the Whole Dog Journal

Other foods that are high in silica, and which should be avoided, include the hulls of wheat, oats, and rice (hulls are found in whole grains); sugar beets; sugar cane pulp; seafood; potatoes and other root vegetables; onions (which shouldn’t be fed to dogs, anyway); bell peppers; asparagus; cabbage; carrots; apples; oranges; cherries; nuts and seeds; grains; soybeans; and the herbs alfalfa, horsetail, comfrey, dandelion, and nettles. Bentonite clay, a mineral supplement, is also high in silicates.

Dogs who drink water from sources containing sand may develop silica uroliths, so water that contains silica (a primary mineral in sand) should be avoided. In hard-water areas, distilled water is recommended for dogs who form silica stones. Silica stones have also been associated with pica, an eating disorder that causes dogs to eat dirt, rocks, and other non-food items.


So not just grains, but some veggies and fruits and seafood.  So my Fromm's Salmon Tunalinni is probably not a good one for you.  Not sure if they might have something that would be as they have a wide variety of foods. 

Gina Pizzo
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 12:30:08 PM
I was wondering myself how you would know about silica content in dog food.   

From the Whole Dog Journal

Other foods that are high in silica, and which should be avoided, include the hulls of wheat, oats, and rice (hulls are found in whole grains); sugar beets; sugar cane pulp; seafood; potatoes and other root vegetables; onions (which shouldn’t be fed to dogs, anyway); bell peppers; asparagus; cabbage; carrots; apples; oranges; cherries; nuts and seeds; grains; soybeans; and the herbs alfalfa, horsetail, comfrey, dandelion, and nettles. Bentonite clay, a mineral supplement, is also high in silicates.

Dogs who drink water from sources containing sand may develop silica uroliths, so water that contains silica (a primary mineral in sand) should be avoided. In hard-water areas, distilled water is recommended for dogs who form silica stones. Silica stones have also been associated with pica, an eating disorder that causes dogs to eat dirt, rocks, and other non-food items.


So not just grains, but some veggies and fruits and seafood.  So my Fromm's Salmon Tunalinni is probably not a good one for you.  Not sure if they might have something that would be as they have a wide variety of foods. 

Gina Pizzo

Thank you, i seem to keep hitting block walls with this, but learning a lot-thank you for your information
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 12:31:58 PM
i have looked at all of these foods and they all have great protein but then lots of veggies that he is not suppose to have.  I am really struggling here, he can not live on white rice and chicken much longer, he is really hungry for some food with substance and i am sure that he is becoming malnourished
You may have to look into making food for him, I would highly recommend Monica Segal. She does canine nutrition consults and does an excellent job.
Amanda

I talked to her today thank you-problem still not solved


Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 03:05:23 PM
OK looks like the choice is going to Natures Variety RAW  I feel really good about  this, going to Reno tomorrow to pick it up.


Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 22, 2016, 07:26:23 PM
ok maybe not- oh my gosh this is really driving me crazy- now maybe Zignature
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 27, 2016, 10:58:36 AM
ok i made a decision on a food for all my fur babies-YAY  so now on to the next stumbling block. We feed DASUQUIN with msm -well it has soy in it so i need to change this as well. Any suggestion for a joint supplement and a good multivitamin.
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: Marj Vincent on July 27, 2016, 12:01:37 PM
I give my boys  Nutramax  Cosequin DS Plus MSM  Joint Health Supplement.  I buy it at Costco, but it is sold on Amazon too, and pet stores. 

I do not give a multivitamin because they receive a balanced diet with their meals. But I do supplement with coconut oil and salmon oil for the Omegas. And their coats are very shiny! 
Title: Re: Dog Food Suggestions
Post by: tonyterry on July 27, 2016, 06:05:33 PM
i am looking forward to picking your brain about feeding these children of ours. See you Friday :)