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General => General Discussion => Topic started by: giddyup on April 08, 2018, 04:14:31 PM

Title: Champs site possibility?
Post by: giddyup on April 08, 2018, 04:14:31 PM
Hi, I recently saw this on a friends page announcing a very large horse show circuit (?) adding this new location for their championship:
 
 "The new Great New York State Fair Expo Center is a state-of-the-art Expo Center and Equestrian facility, and is scheduled to open in summer 2018.  It features two indoor competition arenas and two schooling areas, as well as 500 permanent stalls, permanent RV hookups, permanent restrooms, permanent food service and ample parking.  The main Indoor Arena measures 200' x 300' and offers seating for 4500 spectators."

The friend whose page I saw this on, also wondered if this would be available to rent for large dog shows.

Just an idea....:)

Jill
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Chris Nelson on April 08, 2018, 04:40:53 PM
Definitely worth looking into!

I wonder what the cost would be for a place like that.   Never hurts to ask though


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Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: giddyup on April 08, 2018, 05:18:05 PM
was just looking at the New York State Fair website and this was there (not sure how much info they would have for the new facility yet, but...)

  "To book an event or for more information, please contact The New York State Fairgrounds Events Department  581 State Fair Blvd, Syracuse, NY 13209  (800)475-FAIR or (315)487-7711 ext 1222  email gary.kerr@agriculture.ny.gov

Jill
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: danforth on April 08, 2018, 05:18:13 PM
That would be so close for those of us in New England and NY.

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Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Foomin Z on April 08, 2018, 06:26:00 PM
Who doesn't like a fresh, shiny, new facility? :D

Conformation/obedience dog shows have been held in the concrete floor buildings at the fairgrounds, so they are used to hosting dog people. Lots of hotels that accept dogs too.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Ajilldogs on April 09, 2018, 11:11:56 AM
Hi, I recently saw this on a friends page announcing a very large horse show circuit (?) adding this new location for their championship:
 
 "The new Great New York State Fair Expo Center is a state-of-the-art Expo Center and Equestrian facility, and is scheduled to open in summer 2018.  It features two indoor competition arenas and two schooling areas, as well as 500 permanent stalls, permanent RV hookups, permanent restrooms, permanent food service and ample parking.  The main Indoor Arena measures 200' x 300' and offers seating for 4500 spectators."

The friend whose page I saw this on, also wondered if this would be available to rent for large dog shows.

Just an idea....:)

Jill
Why not the event center in Reno?


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Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Chris Nelson on April 09, 2018, 11:31:54 AM
Hi, I recently saw this on a friends page announcing a very large horse show circuit (?) adding this new location for their championship:
 
 "The new Great New York State Fair Expo Center is a state-of-the-art Expo Center and Equestrian facility, and is scheduled to open in summer 2018.  It features two indoor competition arenas and two schooling areas, as well as 500 permanent stalls, permanent RV hookups, permanent restrooms, permanent food service and ample parking.  The main Indoor Arena measures 200' x 300' and offers seating for 4500 spectators."

The friend whose page I saw this on, also wondered if this would be available to rent for large dog shows.

Just an idea....:)

Jill
Why not the event center in Reno?


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Would be an option for the west coast.   Wouldn’t work too well for the east coast champs though :)


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Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: mstomel on April 09, 2018, 02:10:26 PM
The event center is nice in Reno and they have the equestrian center than they ran regionals at last year too which is really nice, but I have no idea if it's big enough to accommodate champs. I mean, Colorado is the middle of the country if the attempt is to try and have it somewhere static. Or you just bounce them from one side of the country to the other and there will always be a coast that can't make the drive. I just hope that wherever they pick has cheap hotels nearby.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: bettyj.carter on April 10, 2018, 09:46:30 AM
The Event Center in Reno/Sparks is very nice. Just had AKC Nationals there, 3 rings in the main building and 1 in a connecting building. Plenty of crating space, however, very few stalls. Dirt got a bit dry and slick by the afternoon.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: MoabDiane on April 10, 2018, 10:13:16 AM
Sorry, I don't have any specific suggestions for sites.  I've mentioned this before, but since the topic is up, here goes again.
I like very much that Champs "rotates" east to west every other year.  But I also think that having it on either coast is just too far east or west.
While I'd love to go to California, ain't no way I'm going to New York!  LOL!

Reno is pretty far west. But Utah/Colorado/Wyoming vs. Illinois/Ohio/Missouri areas are closer for more people.
I think "slightly east (or west) of middle" is the best!

JMHO,
diane
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Chris Nelson on April 10, 2018, 12:23:39 PM
Agreed Diane.

I like Wyoming and Tennessee.

Everyone is going to disagree on which states are a better location though sadly


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Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Foomin Z on April 10, 2018, 01:55:15 PM
The event center is nice in Reno and they have the equestrian center than they ran regionals at last year too which is really nice, but I have no idea if it's big enough to accommodate champs. I mean, Colorado is the middle of the country if the attempt is to try and have it somewhere static. Or you just bounce them from one side of the country to the other and there will always be a coast that can't make the drive. I just hope that wherever they pick has cheap hotels nearby.
Colorado is definitely NOT the middle of the country, not even if you count Alaska and Hawaii.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geographic_center_of_the_United_States#/media/File:USCenterPop_Geographic2010.png
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: MoabDiane on April 10, 2018, 02:11:28 PM
Foomin Z (is that your real name?!   ;D ) -

I wasn't the one who said Colorado was the middle of the country.
But that Wikipedia entry is weird!   It does include AK and HI. So, technically, it is correct.

I think most of us generally think of the middle of the U.S. as the lower 48; and I'm generally thinking of driving distances when it's a Champs location discussion.
It's highly unlikely (though certainly possible!) that someone would drive from AK to Champs; HI is a bit more problematic for driving!

So, from the actual center of the lower 48 (which is on the northern KS border), Colorado really isn't that far.  But I'd still consider it "west" for the purposes of Champs.
(I wish there was somewhere suitable in CO for Champs, but I don't know where that would be...)
Just as Ohio is pretty far "east" - though I'm sure the New Yorkers and others don't think so!

Back to civil discussions....
diane

I'm just glad that NADAC does change locations from year to year. 
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Foomin Z on April 11, 2018, 11:28:41 AM
Nope, even in contiguous ("lower 48") USA, Colorado is not the center and never was.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geographic_center_of_the_contiguous_United_States

The location in the link above would be the center, making it the most-equal place for everyone to drive to, if in the contiguous USA. Let's build an area right there.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Linda W. Anderson on April 11, 2018, 12:59:07 PM
Nope, even in contiguous ("lower 48") USA, Colorado is not the center and never was.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geographic_center_of_the_contiguous_United_States

The location in the link above would be the center, making it the most-equal place for everyone to drive to, if in the contiguous USA. Let's build an area right there.

Having Champs in the center of the country would basically eliminate both coasts.  Moving nearer to the west or east every other year gives those who live further east or west a better chance to attend at least every other year.  And there are some people like me that will travel to Champs no matter where they are held.
Linda
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Amy McGovern on April 11, 2018, 05:54:24 PM
Having Champs in the center of the country would basically eliminate both coasts.  Moving nearer to the west or east every other year gives those who live further east or west a better chance to attend at least every other year.  And there are some people like me that will travel to Champs no matter where they are held.
Linda

Don't forget that there are actually people who *live* and compete in the midwest. This statement makes it sound as if everyone lives on the coasts. We have a thriving midwest NADAC community!

-Amy
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Vicki Storrs on April 11, 2018, 06:09:08 PM

[/quote]
Having Champs in the center of the country would basically eliminate both coasts.  Moving nearer to the west or east every other year gives those who live further east or west a better chance to attend at least every other year.  And there are some people like me that will travel to Champs no matter where they are held.
Linda
[/quote]

What struck me was just “eyeballing” that Wikipedia map,
I’d put SLC  about halfway between the midpoint of the country and the west coast and  maybe Tennessee the midpoint between the KS spot and the East coast (with apologies to maybe Maine and S FL). So the WY, UT sites and the OH, TN sites are probably a pretty fair compromise.
Vicki
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Billie Rosen on April 12, 2018, 06:59:33 AM
This is a subject that reappears every few years.  The U.S. is a large country and some people are going to have to travel a long way no matter where Champs is held.  I expect that the coasts make it especially hard for the most people.  I live in Arizona and had a 60+ hour a week job, but I still managed to get to every NADAC Champs they had, because it meant a whole lot to me.  And although I had small dogs which made flying easier, we worked hard to get those with bigger dogs to Champs.  Wendy Hultsman for several years even drove to San Diego to be able to fly her dog to Champs (an Aussie) because Phoenix was still heat embargoed at the time. 

So yes, it is a hardship, when Champs is far, but I will avow that it has always been worth the effort to go!!!!

And I agree with Diane that I really DON'T want to see two Championships each year.  This is a National event and should remain so!!!!
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Marj Vincent on April 12, 2018, 08:06:10 AM
Don't forget the Canadians who come to Champs!  They too have to travel a lot of distance no matter where it is held!  For many years, Blair Bloxam from Calgary came to Champs....just to be our gate steward!  R.I.P. dear friend.

I agree the Wyoming and Tennessee areas are a great location every other year.  No matter where it is held, people are going to have long drives. Like Billie said.....it is worth the trip!

Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Sandy Langan on April 12, 2018, 08:14:50 AM
I agree, last two champs were a long haul coming from GA. Especially Utah. Having it in TN would be lovely. It’s a great experience worth the trip. It’s very hard to accomadate everyone’s wishes for location. I think NADAC does a great job trying to keep things fair. 💜
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Audri, Cee Cee, Lily, Toto, and Calypso on April 16, 2018, 07:45:08 AM
I budget myself to go to Champs every other year.  I have to drive since there is no way I can put my one dog on a plane and the expense of flying 4 dogs would be too much.  My dogs are not that great, they never make the finals (although my 1 missed it this year by less than 5 seconds) so for me it is all about the fun.  I figured last year's trip (a 6 hour drive) cost me close to $3K after the entry fees, hotel, food, gas, stall rental, video and pictures so a trip to the west coast is not worth the increased expense with my current dogs when I can stay home and have a fun trial here as well.  I need to have a champs within a "reasonable" drive in order for it to work for me.  I figure reasonable is less than 12 hours....  Maybe if I had super-star dogs I would make the trek further but at this point I don't.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Lorrie Stelz on April 19, 2018, 01:50:18 AM
I like Kansas as middle of the country!!  :)  <3
As far as good facilities in the middle of the country, the Tulsa Fairgrounds are excellent! 
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: bhodges865 on April 24, 2018, 10:52:47 AM
I think what people need to remember when throwing out champs locations is not just distance but cost of the facility.  NADAC still has expenses and people to pay so an event center that costs $5000/day is a bit much when you look at trying to keep champs entry costs "reasonable".

Definitely throw ideas out there if you've been to a facility you think may work.  I personally like going to different places.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: kbriefel on May 29, 2018, 09:23:02 AM
Someone at our NADAC trial this past weekend said to me that 2019 Champs was going to be in Lexington, VA.  Did I miss an announcement?
Ken Briefel and Max
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Chris Nelson on May 29, 2018, 10:21:18 AM
Someone at our NADAC trial this past weekend said to me that 2019 Champs was going to be in Lexington, VA.  Did I miss an announcement?
Ken Briefel and Max

They would be jumping the gun... by a lot :)

We were looking at Lexington pretty intently.

But I don’t believe it will work out as the facility isn’t quite what we’re looking for.


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Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: mephalon on May 29, 2018, 12:13:25 PM
Chris- have you checked out http://appalachianexpo.org/ ?

Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Chris Nelson on May 29, 2018, 01:40:17 PM
I'm keeping an eye on it.

But I'm a little nervous about investing into a facility that isn't built yet.

I'm sure it will be great, and once it's built I would definitely make a trip out to see if it would work.



Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Lin Battaglia on May 30, 2018, 10:19:59 AM
Yes, the Reno Livestock Events Center is very nice. But very pricey and restricted with many extra costs. Sharon (NADAC) had tried to use it over the years, however the month of September is always locked in and booked with big horse events each year. Can also be too hot to fly dogs in that month. Perhaps the IRONWOOD EVENT CENTER in Spanish Springs/Reno would work ? 
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Chris Nelson on May 30, 2018, 10:40:03 AM
Yes, the Reno Livestock Events Center is very nice. But very pricey and restricted with many extra costs. Sharon (NADAC) had tried to use it over the years, however the month of September is always locked in and booked with big horse events each year. Can also be too hot to fly dogs in that month. Perhaps the IRONWOOD EVENT CENTER in Spanish Springs/Reno would work ?
I don’t believe ironwood is quite big enough.  Especially when we are doing two rings,  we really need a bare minimum of 120 x 300 for a ring


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Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: mephalon on May 30, 2018, 10:49:02 AM
Any updates on the 2019 location?    ;D 
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Lin Battaglia on May 31, 2018, 07:20:18 AM
Right IRONWOOD is not big enough for CHAMPS, only room for one large ring. But it worked well for a Regional.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Sharon Nelson on May 31, 2018, 08:42:46 AM
Right IRONWOOD is not big enough for CHAMPS, only room for one large ring. But it worked well for a Regional.

Yes Ironwood was perfect for the regional, but would not be big enough for a champs event.

Sharon
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Sheila & the Shelties on June 01, 2018, 02:28:09 AM
Someone at our NADAC trial this past weekend said to me that 2019 Champs was going to be in Lexington, VA.  Did I miss an announcement?
Ken Briefel and Max

They would be jumping the gun... by a lot :)

We were looking at Lexington pretty intently.

But I don’t believe it will work out as the facility isn’t quite what we’re looking for.


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Now THAT is definitely on the EAST coast.  We must also remember to consider "what" center we are talking about.  Geographic Center?  Population Center?  Those are only two variations, and you come up with a different answer for each one.  I think that we should have an East Coast Championships and a West Coast championships.  Before you start screaming, consider it is pretty much that way now.  The one closer to the east will get east and Midwest people, but very few western people  And when it is in the West, there are very few Eastern people.  Perhaps if NADAC could support it, a West and East coast regional, and maybe a Midwest/northern one?  If NADAC could support it, add the ULTIMATE championship with the winners of those regionals going on to that, being held in a different "central" area each year.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Amy McGovern on June 01, 2018, 08:29:16 AM
Chris, have you looked into the Tulsa fairgrounds?  AKC holds their nationals there frequently and it is quite large.  I figure it must be decent for renting if AKC does it over and over, though I admit I haven't run there, only gone to watch.   

-Amy
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Chris Nelson on June 01, 2018, 09:25:46 AM
I’m much more inclined to find a central location,  or even a non central location that works well,  and use that location indefinitely.

It is an issue that the West doesn’t travel east and the east doesn’t travel west.

Taking a page from other venues that hold their main events in Florida every year,  everyone just knows they have to travel their and they plan for it.


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Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Maureen deHaan on June 01, 2018, 09:59:12 AM
The nice thing about rotating it around is that those of use who do not have the luxury of taking a week or more off of work (especially at the start of the school year) can take a couple days when it is closer vs never being able to go...ever

JMO
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Marcy Matties on June 01, 2018, 10:44:03 AM
I’m much more inclined to find a central location,  or even a non central location that works well,  and use that location indefinitely.

It is an issue that the West doesn’t travel east and the east doesn’t travel west.

Taking a page from other venues that hold their main events in Florida every year,  everyone just knows they have to travel their and they plan for it.


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I like the idea of at least the central area every 3rd year.  West one year, East one year, Central one year.  That way you get the middle third of the country handlers.  So you get central people, plus some from the east - just not far east, and some from the west - just not far west.  Gives a more homogenous representation than the "mostly east" vs "mostly west" handlers with the current rotation.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Amy McGovern on June 01, 2018, 11:26:43 AM
I'm in agreement with Marcy.  We are going to champs this year but it is only our 2nd time.  It is never less than a 2 day drive.  I usually simply can't take off work that long! 

p.s. you didn't answer as to whether Tulsa was even on the list to look at.  This is the location:

https://www.exposquare.com

Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: dogrsqr on June 01, 2018, 11:33:15 AM


Now THAT is definitely on the EAST coast.  We must also remember to consider "what" center we are talking about.  Geographic Center?  Population Center?  Those are only two variations, and you come up with a different answer for each one.  I think that we should have an East Coast Championships and a West Coast championships.  Before you start screaming, consider it is pretty much that way now.  The one closer to the east will get east and Midwest people, but very few western people  And when it is in the West, there are very few Eastern people.  Perhaps if NADAC could support it, a West and East coast regional, and maybe a Midwest/northern one?  If NADAC could support it, add the ULTIMATE championship with the winners of those regionals going on to that, being held in a different "central" area each year.
[/quote]

So then those in the middle always "get" to travel?  While east coasters didn't consider Ohio to be east, it was 735 miles from Minneapolis/St. Paul ( 12 hour drive) and Gillette is 744 miles (11 hours).  And yes, we once drove to Calgary for Champs (1200 + miles/20+ hours).

Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Amy McGovern on June 01, 2018, 01:08:37 PM
So then those in the middle always "get" to travel?  While east coasters didn't consider Ohio to be east, it was 735 miles from Minneapolis/St. Paul ( 12 hour drive) and Gillette is 744 miles (11 hours).  And yes, we once drove to Calgary for Champs (1200 + miles/20+ hours).

That's why I'm advocating for Tulsa :) It is definitely geographically middle!  Actually, Hutchinson KS is even more geographically middle and Chris holds regular shows there but he says it is too small for a champs.  Which is too bad as it is a really nice facility! 

-Amy
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Sheila & the Shelties on June 03, 2018, 05:49:50 AM
So then those in the middle always "get" to travel?  While east coasters didn't consider Ohio to be east, it was 735 miles from Minneapolis/St. Paul ( 12 hour drive) and Gillette is 744 miles (11 hours).  And yes, we once drove to Calgary for Champs (1200 + miles/20+ hours).

That's why I'm advocating for Tulsa :) It is definitely geographically middle!  Actually, Hutchinson KS is even more geographically middle and Chris holds regular shows there but he says it is too small for a champs.  Which is too bad as it is a really nice facility! 

-Amy

I did mention the Midwest / Central Area is part of the rotation. As a matter of comparison, we live in the West and if we go to Champs, we will be driving 1100 miles to the supposedly West location.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Rsquared on June 04, 2018, 07:52:25 AM
Just because there’s a “west coast” champs doesn’t mean that people in the west aren’t traveling hugh distances to get there.  Gillette is over 1000 miles and So Jordan is over 750 from my So Cal location.  I think people just have to accept that going to champs is going to involve traveling large distances for most people, esp. if you’re located in some corner of the country.
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: Linda W. Anderson on June 04, 2018, 08:59:13 AM
Just because there’s a “west coast” champs doesn’t mean that people in the west aren’t traveling hugh distances to get there.  Gillette is over 1000 miles and So Jordan is over 750 from my So Cal location.  I think people just have to accept that going to champs is going to involve traveling large distances for most people, esp. if you’re located in some corner of the country.
I totally agree!  I will be driving over 1,700 miles to Champs this year from the east coast.  If you want to go badly enough, you do it!
Linda
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: DeafSheltieMom on June 04, 2018, 01:12:59 PM
Just because there’s a “west coast” champs doesn’t mean that people in the west aren’t traveling huge distances to get there.  Gillette is over 1000 miles and So Jordan is over 750 from my So Cal location.  I think people just have to accept that going to champs is going to involve traveling large distances for most people, esp. if you’re located in some corner of the country.
yup, yup.  It will be about 1250 miles from San Diego.  We are in the southwestern corner of the country, so travel is travel, wherever Champs ends up being.  And I'm okay with that...  folks just need to decide what they can afford to give, time and money, towards a Champs trip.  Since I don't compete in other venues, I save up my travel and time for Champs, every other year, when it is on the western side of the country, knowing full well that it will take 2-3 days of travel just to get there.  It is what I can do, and what I'm comfortable doing. 

-dayle and tesla in Poway, CA (northeast of San Diego)
Title: Re: Champs site possibility?
Post by: ricbonner on June 04, 2018, 05:49:12 PM
East... West...  Its all far from the South.

Plano, TX to South Jordan, UT (West)---1225 miles
Plano, TX to Dublin, OH (East)-----------1050 miles
Plano, TX to Gillette, WY (West)---------1115 miles