Author Topic: Pep rally for a northeast championships!  (Read 4402 times)

MoabDiane

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #15 on: March 28, 2016, 04:59:49 PM »
OK, every pep rally has a nay-sayer, right?  That'll be me this time!  Please don't hate me.....

Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Missouri, Kansas....none qualify as "northeast."  But that's as far as I'm willing to/can go.
I know west coast folks think of Illinois as "east" - but I do like the middle-of-the-country locales.
Southeast isn't my favorite either - too many ticks/fleas/mites!  Not to mention humidity....

OK, back to my lovely dry desert life.   8)

diane

Foomin Z

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #16 on: March 29, 2016, 09:00:17 AM »
Rebels generally go behind the bleachers to smoke by themselves, rather than joining the pep rally, right?

I still don't understand why the Harrisburg, PA location is unsuitable. AKC champs were there recently, and their nationals entry is much, much larger than NADAC. Surely there is enough space there.

Also, why would Georgia and North Carolina be considered, when there are so few NADAC trials in each of those states? I was looking at trials scheduled in the NADAC calendar. Are they central to a significant portion of NADAC membership?

mephalon

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #17 on: March 29, 2016, 09:13:26 AM »
Space is not the only criteria from what I understand.   It may be the first hurdle but then you need to take price into account and the running surface.   From my understanding, and no disrespect to that organization intended, AKC is not quite as conscientious as to what they think an acceptable surface may be.       

It is hard to find the perfect storm of a place big enough with the right surface that does not break the bank.

Mary P.

Sara Langston

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2016, 06:45:07 AM »
Also, why would Georgia and North Carolina be considered, when there are so few NADAC trials in each of those states? I was looking at trials scheduled in the NADAC calendar. Are they central to a significant portion of NADAC membership?

We are fighting/struggling soooooooooo hard to bring more NADAC to the Southeast that, maybe, if Champs was in GA, we could show people what fun it is and generate lots more interest.  Having Champs in this part of the country would certainly give the "fence sitters" a chance to experience NADAC.  It would also help our trial entries to know Champs would be coming to this area.  People would have something to work towards.   JMHO

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KarissaKS

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #19 on: March 30, 2016, 07:50:31 AM »
Sadly, having NADAC Championships in IL (twice now) has not helped raise interest in Wisconsin and Minnesota.   :(  We continue to lose NADAC trials/clubs.

I'll admit that my thinking is selfish because I live in the middle, but I do think that the more central locations open up the possibility of attending to the greatest number of people.
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Foomin Z

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #20 on: March 30, 2016, 03:39:48 PM »
Alternating between a west location and a "central" location is still forcing eastern US exhibitors to make the greater effort to attend. It's a reality in other venues that not everyone can make every nationals due to location rotation. If a venue wants to be inclusive, it should give everyone a fair chance.

While it is true that holding the TDAA champs in Vermont doubled their normal nationals entry, attendance at regular TDAA trials afterward did not hold in the region. That has to do with the rules that are in place for regular trials. It's a challenging venue. If people don't like the rules for the regular trials, they will not attend.

Ed and Dino

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #21 on: March 30, 2016, 05:12:28 PM »
Alternating between a west location and a "central" location is still forcing eastern US exhibitors to make the greater effort to attend. It's a reality in other venues that not everyone can make every nationals due to location rotation. If a venue wants to be inclusive, it should give everyone a fair chance.

While it is true that holding the TDAA champs in Vermont doubled their normal nationals entry, attendance at regular TDAA trials afterward did not hold in the region. That has to do with the rules that are in place for regular trials. It's a challenging venue. If people don't like the rules for the regular trials, they will not attend.

From our East coast locations we may think Utah is the West but if you were a Nadac exhibitor living in Oregon or Washington (state) I doubt you'd consider Utah an easy, quick trip. It is all a matter of perspective. Illinois may not be East coast but it is the East for people living west of the Mississippi. If Champs was located in the NE I doubt someone on the east coast of Florida or Georgia would consider it close to them. For people in the eastern half of the US Illinois is certainly closer than Utah.

One of the hardest things for the Eastern States is "COST" a facility is likely to cost much more on the East Coast. Breakeven is a very important consideration.

An as aside it would be good if people sign there posts. From mine you see I'm speaking from the expensive state of NJ where we tax you on everything and charge you a fortune to drive on our turnpike especially if you are hauling a trailer.
Ed & Dino (At the Bridge)
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Pam Kaye

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #22 on: March 30, 2016, 07:47:00 PM »
I'm following this conversation with interest, but I don't know who Foomin Z is.  Could you also tell us your name?  Not that I'd know you, since I'm from the West coast and presume you are from the other one, but it's just nice to know who folks are.
Pam Kaye
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Foomin Z

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2016, 10:29:05 PM »
Here's a place I went to for a UKC on PA trial years ago.

http://www.diamond7arena.com

And I found another in PA:

http://www.mountainspringarena.com/Arena-Rental.html


Vicki Storrs

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #24 on: March 31, 2016, 04:32:36 AM »
Here's a place I went to for a UKC on PA trial years ago.

http://www.diamond7arena.com

And I found another in PA:

http://www.mountainspringarena.com/Arena-Rental.html

The second one, mountain springs, says on the first page that the arena is 125' X 225', so too small for the Champs minimum requirements of 125' X 300' clear span.
Vicki Storrs

TheQuestKnight

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #25 on: March 31, 2016, 08:59:06 AM »
I have followed this thread with a great deal of interest, even though I have no vested interest in where Championships are held, since my NADAC agility is now restricted to portions of VT designs that I can set up in our yard for our dogs.  However, during my active time in agility, in one way or another, I have participated in Championship, National and Regional events in multiple venues in capacities ranging from being a member of the ring crew, to a judge to helping organize, produce and direct the event.  Organizing, producing and directing the event is BY FAR the MOST STRESSFUL and MOST THANKLESS job(s) of all, so please....................for the sake of the NADAC "Brass", keep that foremost in your mind and your posts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NADAC is the ONLY venue that I know of that does NOT have corporate sponsors for their events.  I've NEVER seen banners or advertisements hanging around the rings, or in show catalogs.......................or anywhere..............................the entire event is OF NADAC, BY NADAC and FOR NADAC's human and canine extended family.  ALL of the equipment is brought in by NADAC from NADAC headquarters..................there are NO equipment manufacturers supplying the equipment that they then sell to the highest bidder after the event.  NONE of the equipment is wired with cameras for views of dogs in tunnels or wherever for post-event video productions, so the burden of paying the bills rests with NADAC.....................

NO ONE is more particular as it involves as near perfect running surface for dogs and handlers as is NADAC and Sharon Nelson..............................and that includes differently-abled handlers that use mobility carts, etc..................................and I would conservatively estimate that 95% of arena surfaces would NOT meet NADAC's criteria without some modifications and "soil" enhancements, so the site management also needs to be willing to work with NADAC to bring the running surface up to NADAC specifications.

As Ed pointed up.............................anywhere near the east coast, west coast or the Gulf Of Mexico is in "the rent is too damn high" district......................and that also includes food, lodging, fuel...................just about everything and anything.

Given the time of year that NADAC holds it's championships, EVERY section of the country has it's fair share of positives and negatives.  We live in northeast Ohio, so I can speak relatively comfortably when it comes to the upper Midwest............................and we travel extensively in New England.....................

Also, IMHO, NO other agility venue provides as many exhibitor perks in the way of ribbons, rosettes, awards and other tangible forms of recognition of achievements as does NADAC at their Championships.............................and, again IMHO, NO other venue offers as many options to be able to come and participate!

In the upper Midwest, put Lyme disease-carrying deer ticks at the top of the liabilities list...................and the NASTY critters are EVERYWHERE..............................ditto the northeast on that one.  Upper Midwest weather can range from "early November rain" to a pleasant Autumn day to as HOT, HUMID and MUGGY as the southeast.

Suitable sized arenas are FEW and FAR between........................in general, we are not as "horse-centric" as other areas of the country, so the demand for those types of arenas is not particularly high, save for the state and assorted county fairs, and many of those are on a downhill slide and facilities are really showing their "rust belt" age.  If you happen to be in search of convention centers, concert venues and sports arenas.........................we have many hundreds to choose from in all shapes and sizes.

However, even in inland states, where costs tend to be less than in coastal regions, get too close to the Finger Lakes in New York, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinnati, Indianapolis, Chicago, etc.......................and the costs jump...............................and the downside there is that those cities are in overall states of decay, save a few pockets where there is a small revival.

Also, the upper Midwest is NOT exactly a "hot bed" of NADAC activity...........................for 2016, there are 0 (ZERO) scheduled trials in Ohio, 3 scheduled trials (1 club) in east-central Michigan 6 scheduled trials (2 clubs) in northwestern New York, 0 scheduled trials in Pennsylvania, 6 scheduled trials (1 club) in Kentucky, 2 scheduled trials (2 clubs) in Indiana and 11 scheduled trials in Illinois (2 clubs)......................NOT a substantial exhibitor base to support a Championships in the upper Midwest UNLESS A LOT of folks from both east and west of Ol' Man River commit to come!

It has been my experience that NADAC "bends over backwards" to be as fair to as many exhibitors as they can be; but when the final decision is made regarding location, there MUST be an expectation of breaking even financially..........................and perhaps even realizing a little profit, which always finds it's way back into the betterment of NADAC.

Does it suck to live a great distance from where you'd like to go?  Yes.  Does it suck to live in a NADAC desert? Yes.  Is the most important thing the fact that we have an agility venue that is committed to and cares about our and our dogs' safety above all else, provides those of us that live in NADAC deserts to still find a way via the VT program to earn titles and awards, provides us with accessible course designs that we can use to teach our dogs needed skills???  IMHO, YES...................................and those POSITIVES FAR OUTWEIGH ANY negatives regarding where...........................or where not...........................Championships are held.

Respectfully,

Al & Barb Ceranko, Pelli, Katie & Lily in Ohio   
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Foomin Z

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #26 on: March 31, 2016, 10:20:05 AM »
I didn't know it was wrong to gather information. I didn't know someone here said Champs MUST be held in the north east. I didn't know someone said these required northeast Champs must be held in 2017. I didn't know it was wrong to try to raise interest in a region. I mistakenly thought it would be fun to discuss this. I mistakenly thought I could be involved in leading a discussion. But I won't apologize for trying, even though it seems I have offended the status quo. I'll go to a NADAC Champs someday. I will do my best not to bother anyone there.

TheQuestKnight

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #27 on: March 31, 2016, 11:22:14 AM »
There is NOTHING "wrong" with gathering information!  However, in an open forum setting, some of the information that you gather may run counter to your point of view.

There is NO "status quo" in NADAC!  NADAC is, IMHO, the most progressive agility venue in existence.....................and receptive to discussing just about anything in a civil manner.....................

There have been contributors to this thread that have been long-time NADAC associates, perhaps some even go back to NADAC's inception in 1993...........................and they have multiple Championships experiences.

Personally, I joined NADAC in 2004; but depending on perspective at any given moment in time, I have had both the fortune and mis-fortune of experiencing agility from the viewpoint of the exhibitor as well as a member of the corporate structure of an agility venue...........................and sometimes as both, since I participated in multiple venues.

The ONLY thing that I see being offered up here are FACTS coming from experienced exhibitors.

While "pep rallies" can be fun, if the team doesn't have ALL of it's "i"s dotted and "t"s crossed the rally starts out il..................and quickly becomes seriously ill..........................

If you are indeed serious about leading a serious discussion on this subject, I would strongly suggest that you initiate contact with the NADAC office and get a FULL LISTING of Championships requirements as far as the physical facilities are concerned.  IF you are able to find such a location, the submit with the details after you ensure that the site meets ALL of NADAC's criteria.  At least then, NADAC would be in a position to begin negotiating costs...........................so even if all physical conditions are met, there is still NO guarantee!

It's one thing to say "I want................." or "It would be nice if................."; but it's quite another to grab the bull by the tail, face the situation.........................and go about putting together a proposal worthy of consideration................................

Perhaps I am mistaken, which is possible, it's happened a time or two before in my life <LOL>; but the "Rebels generally go behind the bleachers to smoke by themselves, rather than joining..." comment seemed a bit "chippy" to me, then again, perhaps I am too thin-skinned to be on an open forum......................since those that I assume you consider "rebels" have ALL had the courage...............and courtesy...........................to identify themselves.  Et tu, Foomin Z?

Al & Barb Ceranko, Pelli, Katie & Lily in Ohio

 
Castle Camelot: Al, Barb, Dred, Gael & Pellinore . . . and from The Bridge Grill & Pub,  Kali, Flurry, Promise, Chico, Romulus, Trix and Tony.

Rosemary

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #28 on: March 31, 2016, 12:00:59 PM »
I live in the Northeast and am hoping to qualify for a trip to Champs in 2017 or later.  I see no harm in opening a discussion to see if it can be held a little closer to home.  I would think starting a discussion would be the first step in getting information.  Here in little RI there are at least 6 trials on the calendar.  There are many in NJ, VT, MD, PA and NY. 

I totally appreciate that NADAC has high standards and will not compromise them.  I also appreciate that those in charge are open to suggestions.  Personally, I think this conversation should be held and considered as just that.  Conversation.

Rosemary
Connecticut

Foomin Z

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Re: Pep rally for a northeast championships!
« Reply #29 on: March 31, 2016, 01:17:27 PM »
A forum is a place for discussion, a conversation, as Rosemary helpfully pointed out. I thank her for that.

A forum is not a planning committee, as some people are seeing it here. Nothing is being set in stone here. Or is it??

And I have to explain jokes? No one has seen movies about high schools/pep rallies/rebels behind bleachers? It's a standard trope. The 1980's were filled with this scenario in entertainment. Will adding "LOL" or "haha" at the end of jokes be helpful? I get the feeling I am at one of those political rallies I read about on the news that are encouraging people to take care of others with their fists. Haha.

TDAA champs were fun. DOCNA champs were fun. CPE champs were fun, but none increased attendance at local/regional trials. People will enter what they want. What champs does is give extra pride for the locals who get to host it. It's an honor, and it is a ton of work. It's a festival for the region. Even if it doesn't come back to that place for ten years or more, like AAC champs this year for Montreal, no one should be saying, "Champs should not be in X place," and leave it at that with no logical or helpful explanation. That is hurtful and rude to the people who live there and are fans of the venue.

I took the lead in ASKING if anyone knew of someplace suitable for a NADAC champs. The internet can be sometimes difficult to search. Maybe there are hidden gems that someone lives near and could share. It happens! I had no idea such a large facility existed in Hamburg, NY, what I thought was such a rural area of western NY. I thought the NY state fairgrounds were the big fairgrounds in the state, and I sure wouldn't suggest that. It's kind of dirty there with a lot of asphalt paving. Same for the Big E grounds in Springfield, MA. There's a lot of various agility trials in the Hamburg/Buffalo area, with lots of dog-friendly hotels, places to eat, and an airport right there. People could even zip over to the famous Falls if they wanted to. Is that fairgrounds up to NADAC spec? I don't know. Maybe someone else here does.