Author Topic: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers  (Read 14116 times)

Linda W. Anderson

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #45 on: January 30, 2017, 11:26:52 AM »
We'll be doing a facebook live discussion at 3PM EST today.
I'll try to cover a few things.
On the NADAC facebook page?
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Rena Bonem

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #46 on: January 30, 2017, 11:38:47 AM »
I will not be sorry to see the ex-pens leave the ring.  I have seen more than one dog run full speed into one though I am sure it was the handlers fault, I do see a risk involved with inserting them into a hoopers course.  I think they do have a purpose in training, but when handlers blindly try to do courses as fast as possible, they do pose a risk for the dog.

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Sara Langston

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #47 on: January 30, 2017, 11:39:17 AM »
Our club was going to offer it for the first time in May.  More would have been coming.  I guess I'll have to voice my opinion by not entering Hoopers anymore, or Barrelers either.

Gina

You definitely could!   But it wouldn't change this sadly.

The difference with those classes is that they are actually getting bigger.   Numbered Hoopers and even Barrelers, which is a surprise to me, have gotten larger over the years.  X-Hoopers has not.   It leveled out and the truth is that the same people who were entering it 4 years ago are the same people entering it today.  Which isn't growth.

A lot of people dislike barrelers, but more people are entering it than ever before. Which is why it stayed.  We aren't going to axe something that people are gaining interest in.

It is very sad that you would think X-Hoopers has not been a popular class since the clubs in the Southeast haven't had the opportunity to offer it very much.  Laughing Dog has only had it at two trials, last October and this past weekend, and it has been an overwhelming success!!!!  People were so afraid of the class as it was described to them and from looking at sample course maps.  However, once they saw how it was run, they all wanted to try it and everyone had a blast with it.  So many people were excited about going home and working on their "new skills".   The comment I heard most about X-Hoopers at these trials was that the dogs had so much fun running the course.  Also, the entry numbers were very comparable to the entry numbers for all the other classes in these trials. 

I loved Strategy Hoopers and it went away.  And now, X-Hoopers is going away before we have had a chance to really embrace it.  Here in the Southeast, we only have a few trials each year so we can take advantage of a newly introduced class as quickly as areas where there are trials almost every weekend or at least twice a month. 

It really makes me sick that X-Hoopers is going away.  It was one of the few things left that really set NADAC apart from the other venues.  So, so, so disappointed. 

Sara
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Sharon Nelson

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #48 on: January 30, 2017, 11:40:43 AM »
Having had some time to consider these changes, I have some questions/concerns.
1.  Personally, I am sad to see X-hoopers go away.  Given a choice, I would have voted to keep X-hoopers with gates/X-pens over Numbered Hoopers.  The new class seems like just another Numbered Hoopers course with some different sequences/challenges.
2.  My club hosted one X-games trial back in 2014.  While the trial was well received, we never repeated it due to several factors not related to the actual classes.  We hold outdoor trials and have limited daylight, so, until this year, we haven't offered X-hoopers.  Due to the Champs requirement of having 20 points in X-Hoopers to qualify, there has been renewed interest in this class and we were expecting an increase in entries.   
3.  Our gates and hoops have been funded by myself, mostly, and some other club members.  I just made 3 more gates to be in compliance with the new size of the gate circle-my cost again.   So... on a personal level, I have quite a bit of money invested in X-hoopers. 
4.  My club's trial is coming up at the end of March and we are offering both Numbered Hoopers and X-Hoopers on our premium.  I am concerned about what the changes will do to our entries, not to mention the many questions I will be getting about combining points and what level to enter.  Will we be able to amend the premium and if so, what class(es) can we add and stay within the guidelines.  Is there still a requirement that Regular be offered on all three days if more that 3 runs are offered on Friday?
Sorry for adding to your already big headache!
Linda Anderson
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Roanoke, VA

As far as #4, there are no changes to the existing rules about what classes must be or cannot be offered.  A change in Hoopers will not change any other rules already in place.

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Vicki Storrs

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #49 on: January 30, 2017, 12:47:28 PM »
So we have a trial coming up in February offering X Hoopers. Do I enter at their X Hoopers level or at their numbered Hoopers level? 

Oh, also Chris, you're doing a live discussion on Facebook...is Facebook now an "official" NADAC resource?  I am not on Facebook, and hope I don't have to be, but do check the Forum at least daily (and once I figured it out, find it ever so easy to do so).  Can I express an opinion that while it's not necessarily bad to have multiple resources for information IF the same info goes out everywhere, I find it challenging when I hear that there are Some details provided one way and other information coming out at another source... not conflicting, necessarily, but providing an incomplete picture if you only access one or the other.

I also will be sorry to see X Hoopers go.  I haven't run it much, and am probably part of the problem' or the low entries, since it wasn't offered often here I chose to spend my $ elsewhere.  But I did and do LIKE the class and the Champs requirement has meant that it's starting to show up more often, making it easier to justify entering.  Also, I was one of those who bit the bullet and sprang for the ex pens so I could practice at home...no small expense. However I think I can still use it as a good training option, or, if not, I am set with ex pens FOR LIFE!!

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Brenda George

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #50 on: January 30, 2017, 01:40:48 PM »
I feel like I just lost a lot of Novice X hooper points!   My dogs are in Elite # hoopers.  When you say the points will be combined I am guessing you will NOT transfer my Novice points to Elite hoopers. Also will I need to get an Open title ( 30 pts) in X hoopers before moving them up to Elite X hooopers?
Brenda George

A Jussero

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #51 on: January 30, 2017, 01:59:46 PM »
Loved XHP using the gates, dogs loved it also.  X-pens made me nervous safety-wise.  Numbered hoopers is just another jumpers course but for my old, blind dog it was easy on his body and I could stay right beside him to guide with my voice.  So, if you add lines where the gates were, please make that remain always an option, never a requirement.
Ann J.

Chris on Mushtown Road

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #52 on: January 30, 2017, 02:08:52 PM »
You can also go to the first post in this very thread, where the announcement video is posted.




You can watch them later

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk
Chris in MN
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Edraith

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #53 on: January 30, 2017, 03:30:33 PM »
I really like the idea of tape on ground like chances to earn bonus 5 points. Seems like a good compromise and i really enjoy trying distance work because with SAR most our things are distance. Although usually im following my dog in SAR since its her nose we are listening to, ive already started using "here" a lot of i change direction and need her to check where Im at (if i hit an area boundary or such, for example). Its really helped us because my Come can be right in front of me proper recall and Here is a flyby/check my direction.

If the tape on ground circle passes as a solution, can it be implimented with VT for 15?
« Last Edit: January 30, 2017, 03:32:39 PM by Edraith »
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mephalon

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #54 on: January 30, 2017, 05:08:41 PM »
I like the idea of a line on the ground and would love to see that option at all levels not just Elite (thinking bonus box/lines which are just Elite).

Give the Intro/Novice/Open the extra 5 point option as well please.

Mary
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George A

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #55 on: January 30, 2017, 05:23:40 PM »
Chris,
Count me in the disappointed camp.  I really enjoyed the X-Hoopers.

Now, accepting that there will be a change---I do like the idea of the tape "line" for  an extra 5 points.   And, would like to suggest perhaps a second tape "line" that might offer an extra 10 point challenge.  This would give a total of 15 or 20 points depending on the challenge and success of completing those challenges.

George Axtell

dogrsqr

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #56 on: January 30, 2017, 07:35:32 PM »
Honestly I have always tried and entered the classes that I have not liked.  I'm frustrated that people just want to do what's comfortable and easy and can't push themselves.  I complain, probably more than the average bear, but I still do it.  I pushed myself to run XGC because I understood that it would make me a better handler.  I continue to push myself to occasionally enter Barrelers even though it frustrates me because it will make me a better handler.  Why can't we just leave X-Hoopers and let those that like it play it?  Does it matter that the numbers are low?  I think what's being said here is that it would have grown this year.  We have offered numbered hoopers and barrelers even though we get about 1/2 the entries of every other class at a trial.  At this point we're just looking for entries anywhere we can get them.

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Chris Nelson

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #57 on: January 30, 2017, 07:42:33 PM »
So we have a trial coming up in February offering X Hoopers. Do I enter at their X Hoopers level or at their numbered Hoopers level? 

Oh, also Chris, you're doing a live discussion on Facebook...is Facebook now an "official" NADAC resource?  I am not on Facebook, and hope I don't have to be, but do check the Forum at least daily (and once I figured it out, find it ever so easy to do so).  Can I express an opinion that while it's not necessarily bad to have multiple resources for information IF the same info goes out everywhere, I find it challenging when I hear that there are Some details provided one way and other information coming out at another source... not conflicting, necessarily, but providing an incomplete picture if you only access one or the other.

I also will be sorry to see X Hoopers go.  I haven't run it much, and am probably part of the problem' or the low entries, since it wasn't offered often here I chose to spend my $ elsewhere.  But I did and do LIKE the class and the Champs requirement has meant that it's starting to show up more often, making it easier to justify entering.  Also, I was one of those who bit the bullet and sprang for the ex pens so I could practice at home...no small expense. However I think I can still use it as a good training option, or, if not, I am set with ex pens FOR LIFE!!

Vicki's Storrs

We're uploading the video from facebook now so that we can post it here :)

DebbieP

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #58 on: January 30, 2017, 08:07:36 PM »
I understand the need on NADAC's part to not offer classes that aren't filling.  And I understand that people already have to pick and choose from a full array of classes.  However, I truly loved X-Hoopers.  At first, I was frustrated and one of my dogs who is a typical bull in a china shop had difficulty the first time I ran him; he plowed right into the gate, but luckily he wasn't at all daunted or hurt and just continued on the course.  Since then, he and my other dog just lit up when we ran X-Hoopers. They loved it!  It tests handling, distance, and timing in a way that other classes don't.  I will miss it.  Because I travel a bit  sometimes to trial, I had run XHoopers elsewhere, but here in KY, we've just begun offering X-Hoopers.  So it hasn't had much time to take off.  At our January trial, we offered it for the second time and exhibitors were thrilled, cheering each other on.  I've only seen that enthusiasm in Chances.  I wonder what might have happened if we had offered it sooner, or for a longer time, to see if it would catch on.  Nonetheless, I'm curious to see what the new Hoopers will be like.

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Sandy Langan

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Re: Upcoming changes to Hoopers and X-hoopers
« Reply #59 on: January 30, 2017, 08:11:49 PM »
I am one that is a little disappointed in the announcement on x hoopers but also totally understand the business end of it. The numbers don't lie and you must do whats good for the company or organization. Our club also made a personal investment in both gates and ex pens. I believe the gates are an awesome distance training tool and will continue to be used, and the ex pens will make our animal society very happy if we decide to donate them.  I know there are people  that miss the strategy hoopers. Could we some how blend that into the new class and maybe have a choice of distance challenges to try? A, B, or C. Just something to think about. I agree that the regular hoopers now is just another jumpers class. Maybe doing the circle line and the option of difference tests will kind of give everyone a piece of their favorite version of hoopers and make them happy. Just food for thought. I'm going to support whatever you decide because I love NADAC. I would agree with your first video in that it would be wise to try and not change things anymore. People don't do well with change as you are finding out. I hope they are kind and polite in their words as we have enough rude people out there in the world these days. The news is full of them. Thanks for keeping us up to date. We appreciate that and all your hard work. Sandy Langan