Author Topic: rules clarification please  (Read 968 times)

Lisa Schmit In The Zone Agility

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rules clarification please
« on: November 01, 2018, 06:39:49 AM »
I have some questions about rules.  I have re-read the current rulebook, watched June video again and looked at the announcement rule change page.
Is there a list of the new rules for 2019 besides watching the video? (besides the ones listed on the annoucement page as there are more in the video)

1- Bars:  At champs, the jumps had one bar on them.    I assume that it is acceptable for jumps to have one bar on them. I do not recall seeing this announced anywhere.

2- Startlines: Would you please do a video on acceptable Start-Line training is?   I was unaware that stomping back at my dog was a cause to be kicked out of a trial.  I assumed it was an elimination as it is training  but as long as the person does not make contact with their dog, I thought it was just an elimination.   So what is acceptable start line training to still qualify (Ie not crossing plane of jump) and elimination?

  I also would like clarification on the leash.  I thought the the leash had to hit the ground before the dog left (or did the first obstacle) but I have not seen judges calling this.  I hope that this is addressed as I truly believe it is a safety issue.    A few months ago, I saw a handler take leash off, the dog takes off and the leash got caught in the dog’s leg.
Oh ..and one more thing— can a  handler touch their dog once the leash comes off? 

3- End Behaviors:  Would you please do a video clarifying what end run behaviors are acceptable ie if dog jumps up on handler at the end? nips handlers pants? Is NADAC loosing up this rule?   
The dog is allowed to pick up the leash correct?    As long as the handler is not actively tugging, the dog can have leash in his mouth as they exit the ring as long as the dog has leash over his head correct??? Can handler ask dog to pick up leash? Are there any other rules regarding this?

4- Wording of LevelsRulebook: Levels
The Intro level is an introductory level for every class. The Intro level is for any dog which has not yet earned any NADAC certification in a particular class.

The Novice level is an entry level for every class. The Novice level is for any dog which has not yet earned any NADAC certification in a particular class.

This wording of this “any dog which has not earned any NADAC certification in any particular class” is misleading.   This sounds like only dogs that have not earned any certifications can run in these classes.     Dogs that have earned titles, awards, NATCHEs can run in these classes if they want to. 

5-Is there a rule that a handler cannot break the plane of a jump or weave poles?

6-I heard there was a rule change that the dog can go through the weave poles as an off course (not enter the poles but just run through them) and not be faulted?    Is this true? What about the handler?

New for 2019 rules:
   Any more info about rule changes coming up?
   Would you please provide more detailed information about the new awards? I would like to tell people about these, but I am unclear about them and need written information to share :)
   Training in Ring:  Is it going to be 60 seconds still?
   Do you have a blurb about grandfathering titles from other venues into NADAC so I can include that in my premiums and start telling people about this. 
Any written information about the rule changes would help tremendously!

Thank you
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Sara Langston

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2018, 06:54:35 AM »
I would really like to see something about the "grandfathering" of exhibitors from other venues as I want to put that in my premium as well.  I have a trial coming up in January so I need to get by premium out soon.  Thanks. 

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dogrsqr

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2018, 07:10:19 AM »
Lisa I have specifically asked 2 judges in the last 2 months if I can walk thru the weave poles on my lead out and was told no by both judges.  If it is now legal for the dog to run thru the weave poles (not entering and weaving) I would hope the handler is allowed to do the same.  Sometimes the placement of the weave poles can make a lead out very long and circuitous.
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Marj Vincent

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2018, 08:02:33 AM »
I personally think no one should respond to this post until Chris has responded with his answers.  Lisa has asked good questions that need to be clarified and I would hate to see people read her post and believe rules have changed when they may not have. This is how rumors get started. 
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Chris Nelson

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2018, 11:39:49 AM »
I’m going to be away from my computer until later tonight.

But I can respond to everything then.

As Marj said probably best to wait for my answers,  as there are a lot of things incorrectly mentioned above.


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Chris Nelson

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2018, 06:52:43 PM »
I have some questions about rules.  I have re-read the current rulebook, watched June video again and looked at the announcement rule change page.
Is there a list of the new rules for 2019 besides watching the video? (besides the ones listed on the annoucement page as there are more in the video)

Not really.   I'm sure someone can transcribe the video one of these days.

Quote
1- Bars:  At champs, the jumps had one bar on them.    I assume that it is acceptable for jumps to have one bar on them. I do not recall seeing this announced anywhere.

Wasn't announced because it wasn't really in any rule book that we were aware of.   It was later pointed out that it was in the equipment handbook, albeit in a random section.   So that section has since been updated.   Short version, single bars are okay to use.  But since most clubs already have the bars for two they can keep doing that as well.  Dealers choice.

Quote
2- Startlines: Would you please do a video on acceptable Start-Line training is?   I was unaware that stomping back at my dog was a cause to be kicked out of a trial.  I assumed it was an elimination as it is training  but as long as the person does not make contact with their dog, I thought it was just an elimination.   So what is acceptable start line training to still qualify (Ie not crossing plane of jump) and elimination?

Context is pretty important here.
Stomping at your dog from 15 feet away is probably not going to offend any judge to the point of kicking you out.
Stomping at your dog from 2 feet away is a very different story.    Contact does not have to be made to offend a judge.   People get kicked out of trials for verbal issues with their dogs, so stomping is definitely within the realm of possibility.
I would hope most judges would give a warning first, and then only take those kind of actions if the behavior continued.

If someone stomped at their dog from 2 feet away I would ask them to not run that round, talk to them and ask that it doesn't happen again, and excuse them if it did happen again.
This is one of those situations where you can't really put a exact rule to it.   It's why we have judges, to make those calls.

Quote
  I also would like clarification on the leash.  I thought the the leash had to hit the ground before the dog left (or did the first obstacle) but I have not seen judges calling this.  I hope that this is addressed as I truly believe it is a safety issue.    A few months ago, I saw a handler take leash off, the dog takes off and the leash got caught in the dog’s leg.
Oh ..and one more thing— can a  handler touch their dog once the leash comes off?


It is a fault and judges should be calling it.   This would be something for the exhibitor feedback page so that we can follow up with the specific judge who is not calling this.       
The handler can touch their dog once the leash is off and they have NOT lead out.    If the handler leads out by a step or two, and then returns they can't touch their dog at that time.

Quote
3- End Behaviors:  Would you please do a video clarifying what end run behaviors are acceptable ie if dog jumps up on handler at the end? nips handlers pants? Is NADAC loosing up this rule?   
The dog is allowed to pick up the leash correct?    As long as the handler is not actively tugging, the dog can have leash in his mouth as they exit the ring as long as the dog has leash over his head correct??? Can handler ask dog to pick up leash? Are there any other rules regarding this?

Excluding the leash rules, nothing has really changed here.    A dog jumping on a handler if it's welcomed isn't a big deal.   If the handler is trying to keep the dog off of them and the dog is continually jumping on them it could be an issue, but it's a really grey area and again mainly a judges call.   
Dogs can have the leash in their mouth but they can't be playing with it and the handler can't be actively tugging.   We are doing a video soon to illustrate this a little clearer.

Handlers can't have their dogs target to the leash as a finish behavior.   So the handler can't be saying 'get it, get it' as the dog is finishing the course.    If the dog has completed the course, then the handler can have the dog grab the leash.

Quote
4- Wording of LevelsRulebook: Levels
The Intro level is an introductory level for every class. The Intro level is for any dog which has not yet earned any NADAC certification in a particular class.

The Novice level is an entry level for every class. The Novice level is for any dog which has not yet earned any NADAC certification in a particular class.

This wording of this “any dog which has not earned any NADAC certification in any particular class” is misleading.   This sounds like only dogs that have not earned any certifications can run in these classes.     Dogs that have earned titles, awards, NATCHEs can run in these classes if they want to.

I'm welcome to better wording.

Quote
5-Is there a rule that a handler cannot break the plane of a jump or weave poles?
Definitely.

10 faults.    Assuming this is in reference to breaking the plane with their body, aka walking through the weave poles.
You can put a hand through a jump standard and not have any problems, but don't go jumping through it.

Quote
6-I heard there was a rule change that the dog can go through the weave poles as an off course (not enter the poles but just run through them) and not be faulted?    Is this true? What about the handler?

Not even close to factual.    If the weave poles are not the next correct obstacle in sequence then a dog passing through the poles is 10 faults for an off course.

Quote
New for 2019 rules:
   Any more info about rule changes coming up?
   Would you please provide more detailed information about the new awards? I would like to tell people about these, but I am unclear about them and need written information to share :)
   Training in Ring:  Is it going to be 60 seconds still?
   Do you have a blurb about grandfathering titles from other venues into NADAC so I can include that in my premiums and start telling people about this.

Working on it!

Gotta get caught up on everything else first :)


Edraith

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2018, 01:52:56 PM »
Quote
The Intro level is an introductory level for every class. The Intro level is for any dog which has not yet earned any NADAC certification in a particular class.

The Novice level is an entry level for every class. The Novice level is for any dog which has not yet earned any NADAC certification in a particular class.
what about....(bolded the changes). I get why that's a bit confusing, i think this fixes it?

The Intro level is an optional introductional entry level for every class. The Intro level is open to any dog which has not yet earned any NADAC certification in a particular class.

The Novice level is an entry level for every class. The Novice level is open to any dog which has not yet earned any NADAC certification in a particular class.
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Richard Wolfe

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2018, 03:37:19 PM »
But since you can move back to them if you want, that isn't the exact wording needed.
Richard Wolfe
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Richard Wolfe

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2018, 03:46:32 PM »
The Intro level is an optional introductory level.  It may also be entered by dogs who have attained titles in higher levels at the handler's option.

Novice is a required entry level for dogs that have not attained an agility title in any organization.  It may also be entered by dogs who have attained titles in higher levels at the handler's option.

Do these work.  I'm open to tweaking.
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BeckyAH

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2018, 07:27:32 PM »
The Intro level is an optional introductory level.  It may also be entered by dogs who have attained titles in higher levels at the handler's option.

Novice is a required entry level for dogs that have not attained an agility title in any organization.  It may also be entered by dogs who have attained titles in higher levels at the handler's option.

Do these work.  I'm open to tweaking.

I would use handler's discretion, but I think that otherwise those are perfectly clear.

Jeff Lyons

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2018, 09:12:48 AM »
The Intro level is an optional introductory level.  It may also be entered by dogs who have attained titles in higher levels at the handler's option.

Novice is a required entry level for dogs that have not attained an agility title in any organization.  It may also be entered by dogs who have attained titles in higher levels at the handler's option.

Do these work.  I'm open to tweaking.

I would use handler's discretion, but I think that otherwise those are perfectly clear.


I think the most simple way to state it is:  The Intro level is an optional, introductory level and is available to any dog registered in NADAC.
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Richard Wolfe

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2018, 12:49:35 PM »
Yes, I like that better.
Richard Wolfe
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Chris Nelson

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2018, 06:31:54 PM »
Good suggestions!     We'll revamp the rule book in January to reflect the improved wording :)

Lisa Schmit In The Zone Agility

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Re: rules clarification please
« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2018, 05:19:01 PM »
Chris
here is website that will convert video to text:

https://otter.ai/login

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